Who do we become in true relation to one another?

Richard and Paul were commenting and discussing about a vital topic, read their dialogue if you like: https://julienmatei.com/2012/09/29/so-sad-or-not/#comment-2597

Here is my answer to them.

You seem to do all right in your dialogue without my involvement. :) You maybe are interested to take over Mirrors of Encounters too. It would be quite fun I think ;;)

Anyway, let´s put like this – can anything exist in separateness at all?…Hence, who is this Julien Matei? Is Julien a separate entity? Is he an outcome of total relationless-ness? Or is he a product of different other societal factors, relations, events, people, frictions, dreams and projections?…

Again, is relationless-ness – let´s say, total isolation – a reality…? Is “I” a reality per se, or can it only exist in relation to everything there is?…

Let´s ponder: Where does an entity begin and where does it end?…

So who is Julien when he writes to Paul? Who is Paul when he connects in vivid dialogue with Richard?

Who is Richard when we interact in this uncommon way…? Who do we become, Paul, Julien and Richard – not necessary in this order – when we meet here in this discussion?

If we manage to authentically meet each other in these insights, we realize that the precise entity of Richard, Julien and Paul becomes rather irrelevant. Irrelevant in the sense that none of us remains the same, but each of us grow – hopefully!! – if we allow ourselves to be just little “irrelevant” for a change, and kind of get nourished by the energy of this dialogue we create together.
To grow is to dynamically give up boundaries,- the limited I-ness – and when we have the courage to “lose” ourselves, we come to the understanding that it is fear we let go of, and not our specific identity.

Only fear tries to make sure of its “fixed” identity. Fear tries to “emulate” or not emulate others in order to escape its paradoxical nature – that is, through escaping itself, Fear fiercely struggles to contain itself, to remain the same. Strange but true…Yes, Fear is isolation. I-ness is the derivative of isolation. Only fear can exist in perfect relationlessness. Its worst menace – I am sure you will find this strange – is authentic relation, cause in dependable relation Fear fears its disappearance…

Real Joy created out of togetherness knows no boundary…it explodes indiscriminately in all simultaneous spaces. Thus entity becomes entities, and entities entity…

In this immediacy, we come to the understanding that boundary means possession and in Joy all boundaries dissolve, as Joy cannot possess as there is nothing to possess…Joy is eternal space, reality beyond reality…

Can we see that we are unique but together…? Together but unique…:)

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Paul asking vital questions

Think about it, a world where people’s lives are not wasted by slaving away for some stupid paycheck that barely covers living expenses initially, or goes into some sort of investment to yield more money for another savings scheme.  When does this cycle stop?  Or maybe more importantly, why do so many people let it begin, maintain the cycle and re-cycle until they die?

Back to the Self though, do we not toil away at our own expense to forget who we really are?  Are we really growing in living, or are we shrinking and dying?  These answers are not easily assembled if you really think about it – at least not for me.  You must separate illusion from reality, and think for yourself.  Do you know your Self any better now, right here, today, than you did yesterday, last week, last year?

A comment to Paul

Paul,

It is a sad fact of life: when people detect depression in themselves or, above all, in someone else,
they kind of flee like sparrows. People are usually afraid of introspection. Depression forces us all to look for answers inward… to contemplate – pure and simple – inner reality.

I recognize myself in your words – feeling alone, not having people to talk with. It is true in my case as well: we seem to have more virtual friends, than mates in our very proximity.

What is vital to know is that basically depression is – among other things – the outcome of isolation.
We try to compensate isolation through contact with others… It does never work.

We have to go down into the feeling of isolation, and examine the very nature of it…Not easy though – when you are isolated, whatever you do creates even more isolation.

So what is this isolation about? Can we look at it…? Can we stay with it without trying to flee into conversations…or whatever other ways of escape…?

As long as we don´t directly confront ourselves we will suffer from a constant feeling of loneliness and loss,
that is not going to be healed other than by our sincere readiness to find out…

A dialogue with Paul

Me:

What is “tomorrow”?…

Does Tomorrow exist, is Tomorrow a real entity?… Who “exists” and who “dies”…? Who wants to continue…?

What is Knowledge…? What is it to learn that you don´t already know…? Wouldn´t it be better if you tried to un-know, yes, to un-learn…?

Again…who lives and who dies…?

You say:

“Can humans even understand death? At least, before it occurs?”

If you want to understand what death is about, – or what LIFE is about – you have to have the courage to “die” now…to empty yourself wholly, completely; to let go of everything – which is not easy – to realize that you neither can “live” or “die”, that Life – that is, You – in the deepest sense, never dies.

Yes, you are this imperishable Life. Ultimately it is not about me uttering this, you have to come to the point of feeling this Immediate Truth.

Paul:

This sounds very Buddhist, which is NOT a bad thing. I am intrigued by your words, and would like to further this discussion. How? That is my big question. I feel like I have the answer inside of me already, but how do I access it? How do I realize Truth? And how do I know if I am right? Or furthermore how do I think not of right versus wrong but only recognize what Is?

I am very inexperienced when it comes to spirituality and even philosophy. Guidance please?

One point I have a lot of trouble with is that of knowing – I value education very highly and I am unsure of what unlearning everything really means. Perhaps you could enlighten me? Or at least give me a better idea.

Me:

What I say probably sounds like many different things…What if we just ceased to label things, at least in this our dialogue…?

It is not so much the question about ” How”, it is more about ” Why”.

When Why is clearly stated, the How just comes by itself.

It is not “you” realizing the truth,… Truth “realizes” you, truth has nothing to do with “right” or “wrong”…What is “right” or “wrong” at the end of the day…? Again, stop labeling and listen…

When you listen, you allow the answer inside you to unfold itself. So linger and listen… you will recognize it beyond doubt…it is your very breath, even nearer…

Experience has nothing to do with ” Knowledge”. It is good that you are inexperienced. Please remain that way :)

You need no guidance…you are already guided. Imagine that these words might have been uttered by you through me.

What is education at the end of the day? I am not playing with words pondering on this.

“Unlearning” is dropping all notions about this or that…Not easy though…When all ideas are recognized as mere ideas, what is beyond ideas can manifest itself.

I am sure,
that you can take what I say, although you might not be “used” to this way of expressing things.